The Cure For AIDS Ref A: STEFAN LANKA Dissenter Vindicated On Retrovirus Skepticism   Interview By Mark Gabrish Conlan San Diego -October 1998. Fintan Dunne, Created 30 Jan '03 Editor www.SickofDoctors.com Zenger's: I'd like a little about your background, what your training is, when you studied, what you specialized in, and essentially how you came to these ideas about AIDS.

German researcher, Dr. Lanka is a virologist with wide-ranging expertiese in marine biology, biochemistry and evolutionary biology. He believes that all so-called retroviruses are actually the body's own creations; that hepatitis is an autoimmune disorder (a disease in which the body is attacked by components of its own immune system) rather than a viral disease; that AIDS has nothing to do with immune suppression; and that it should really be called Acquired Energy Deficiency Syndrome -- AEDS -- because its true cause is a breakdown in the delivery of oxygen to the blood and/or body tissues.

Stefan Lanka, Ph.D.: I started studying molecular biology in 1984, and I soon got bored because I learned that all that you have to learn in order to pass the exams is already old, out-of-date dogmatic thinking. So I went into ecology because I realized, while being abroad in different countries, that you can carry out very important research without big machines or big money. I was looking for an opportunity to do molecular genetics in the field of biology, so I chose to move into marine biology and did a lot of electron microscopic studies.

A marine biology professor was willing to let me work for him, and while doing this I found a stable virus-host relationship by accident. In that very moment, I knew that was it. The best way to do meaningful genetic research is to have a stable virus-host relationship, in which a virus is produced in the host but does not kill the host. So you can really study how they interact, how the genetic material of the virus is produced and how it interacts with the host, without manipulating it. That's still the only stable virus-host relationship in virology, other than in bacteria.

I was glad to be able to carry out this study, but first I had to convince my professor so he would agree to finance my new studies. He said he was a classical biologist and he could not sponsor me as a researcher in virology. I needed to find another professor who was willing to guide me, and the very day I found one I got a lab of my own. I could buy all the tools and big machines on my own overtime, so I had the best conditions to start my studies. After one year, I had isolated a virus and characterized it.

When I started doing viral research, it was already 1986, 1987, just when the public in Germany and Europe was starting to become aware of AIDS. Because AIDS was supposedly caused by a virus, I was automatically considered a specialist in the AIDS field. In the beginning, this was a nice feeling. I was telling people what I heard from the mass media and the TV, and I was not checking the evidence because everybody was convinced AIDS was a viral disease. Then I heard about the things that Robert Gallo [American cancer researcher who first identified HIV as the cause of AIDS] was doing wrong, and that he was misleading the public about his first retrovirus [HTLV-I, which Gallo claimed to be the cause of AIDS in 1982, before his alleged discovery of HIV] and he had stolen the virus from Montagnier, and all this kind of gossip.

I already had a somewhat critical attitude when I started studying molecular genetics, so I went to the library to look up the literature on HIV. To my big surprise, I found that when they are speaking about HIV they are not speaking about a virus. They are speaking about cellular characteristics and activities of cells under very special conditions. I was so deeply shocked. I was thinking, "Well, I'm not experienced enough. I have overlooked something. On the other side, those people are absolutely sure." Then I was afraid that speaking about this with my friends, or even my family, they would think is absolutely mad and crazy. So for a long time I studied virology, from the end to the beginning, from the beginning to the end, to be absolutely sure that there was no such thing as HIV. And it was easy for me to be sure about this because I realized that the whole group of viruses to which HIV is said to belong, the retroviruses -- as well as other viruses which are claimed to be very dangerous -- in fact do not exist at all.

Lanka Vindicated

Dec 1998 "I realized that the whole group of viruses to which HIV is said to belong, retroviruses ...in fact do not exist at all. I was wondering what viruses are for... in evolutionary biology and found that ...every one of our genomes, and that of higher plants and animals, is the product of so-called reverse transcription: RNA transcribed into DNA.." Dr. Stefan Lanka Ph.D. Interview in Zengers Magazine Virologist, with experience in marine biology, biochemistry, and evolutionary biology. Says Aids should be called Acquired Energy Deficiency Syndrome -AEDS--because it's a breakdown in the delivery of oxygen in the body.

Jan 2003 "People have totally misunderstood the nature of genetic systems in higher organisms. This will probably turn out to be the greatest failure in the history of molecular biology." Prof. Dr. John S. Mattick Quoted in NY Times 21 Jan 2003 Director: Aus. Genome Research Facility; Institute for Molecular Bioscience Univ. Queensland; ARC Special Research Centre for Functional and Applied Genomics.

Zenger's: So it was just on the basis of this reading that you concluded that what is called HIV, what is considered to be the "HIV virus" and is supposed to be infectious like other viruses that are acknowledged pathogens, really represented a phenomenon within the body. How did you figure that out, and why are you so sure about it?

Dr. Lanka: I was wondering what viruses are for in evolution, because they didn't seem to have any function other than to be very dangerous and killing other cells. So I went into evolutionary biology and found that the first genetic molecule of life was RNA, and only later in evolution did DNA come into existence. Every one of our genomes, and that of higher plants and animals, is the product of so-called reverse transcription: RNA transcribed into DNA.

But I had already realized already by then that the thinking about molecular genetics was very dogmatic. In the early 1960's they came up with the central dogma of molecular genetics, which try to uphold even today, and which is ridiculous. The dogma says that DNA behaves in a static way; DNA makes RNA; RNA cannot be transcribed back into DNA; RNA comes into existence only on the basis of DNA. That was and is the basis, of the central dogma of molecular genetics.

I found that this kind of thought came from research funded by the seed-producing industry of the United States, and that a whole body of existing knowledge -- namely, that of cytogenetics, before World War II -- was just suppressed or even slandered as "lazy science" because it had been carried out mostly in Europe. This kind of science well established that the genetic material is not stable. It is subject to change, and this means the genetic material is reverse-transcribed. It goes in both directions.

This earlier research also established that inside the cell we have a huge amount of genetic material other than that of the nucleus. But because molecular genetics and molecular biology were actually founded by physicists, who thought they could explain the whole structure of the atom just by focusing on the nucleus, when they went into biology they carried over that same mistake. They focused only on the nucleus of the cell and claimed it was responsible for all of how life comes into existence, how it's controlled, etc. This is ridiculous, because they have overlooked the essential of life: the production of energy.

While studying the evolutionary aspects of biology, I quickly realized that reverse transcription is common to all forms of life, and in fact is the basis of all higher living. Later I learned that reverse transcription is a repair mechanism for chromosomal DNA. But the mainstream of molecular genetics is still committed to the central dogma: "There is no such thing as reverse transcription from RNA to DNA." In 1970, when they detected biochemically that there is a reverse flow of genetic material, they didn't give up the dogma or even try to change it. Instead, they called it an exception to the central dogma of molecular genetics, and explained it by postulating the existence of retroviruses.

Zenger's: Excuse me, but I thought that the field of retrovirology had started as far back as 1911, with Peyton Rous and his experiments with chickens. [Rous surgically removed cancerous tumors from chickens in his lab, ground up the tumors, fed them to healthy chickens and observed that the healthy chickens who ate ground-up tumors grew tumors themselves. He concluded that the tumors may have been caused by an infectious agent being transmitted from the sick chickens to the healthy ones.]

Dr. Lanka: No, it was only in retrospect that he was cited as the one who was dealing with retroviruses. What Peyton Rous actually did was he inbred his animals so heavily that the genetic material from the different strains he used to breed became more and more similar. When the animals' genetic materials become too similar to each other, then even more genetic material is interchanged between the chromosomes than happens normally. Often, in inbred animals or plants, on two places of the chromosomes genetic material in between got lost. Then you will see the characteristic chromosomal damages in inbred animals, plants or human beings, resulting in disabilities which are well studied. So, because Rous's chickens were so heavily inbred, they had a high rate of spontaneous cancer induction.

The results from this research were not cited for more than 20 years. Later, some people tried to speculate about them. In the late 1960's and early 1970's they started to think about this because molecular biology took over modern medicine, and argued -- against the existing body of knowledge, of facts -- that cancer is caused by infectious entities: by viruses, or mutations, or viruses causing mutations. They ignored the fact that cancer has something to do with oxygen deficiencies, which had already been established by Otto Warburg's research. Warburg had received his first Nobel Prize demonstrating how a cell is able to produce much more energy than in the process of fermentation, using oxidative respiration. And he had received his second Nobel for proving that cancer is characterized by the process of fermentation; that oxidative respiration is not taking place in cancer. And this has been just ignored.

So in 1970, when they proved that reverse transcription does happen and they discovered the enzyme, reverse transcriptase, which does it, they wouldn't give up the dogma. They changed it slightly and said there is an exception; and that it was associated with the existence of a new class of viruses called retroviruses, which they cannot prove exist in other ways.

When I was absolutely sure about everything I've told you so far, I went public. I was invited to a lot of conferences on marine biology and biology, and at every conference I presented my own data. I used every opportunity to speak out against HIV, and I quickly learned that because I was taking away HIV as an explanation for AIDS and was not able to replace it with something else, and not being able to explain what's going on under the label "HIV," it forced me to watch out and find those people who were able to explain what's going on.

In the beginning, of course, some of the publications of Peter Duesberg helped me a lot, because he was an authority who questioned a lot of things, and that helped me. I translated some of this articles into German and published them in a small publishing house. But then, with time, I learned about other specialists, among them Heinrich Kremer, the well-known German medical doctor, former medical director of the Federal German Drug Abuser Clinics, who helped me to understand what was really going on.

Because he was in charge of the introduction of hepatitis B vaccine into Germany, and used it in his patients, Dr. Kremer checked out the hepatitis B vaccines on the market. He found that the American vaccine, hepatitis B vaccine, was produced with the sera donated by men in the Gay scene in New York City between 1978 and 1980. So, as he knew, there was a lot of sex going on in a minority of these men, and therefore they had had a lot of sexually transmitted diseases. So he was afraid of using this vaccine, and instead he used the French vaccine, which was produced from blood donations by the general population in France.

But in 1983 the German government forced him not to use this vaccine anymore. They said the French vaccine is poisoned by the "AIDS virus" -- at the time when nobody was positively speaking about an "AIDS virus" -- but the American vaccine was O.K. He knew, or he was warned, that this had nothing to do with the science, but it had to do with the fact that the German medical system, in parts of Germany, is virtually a colony of the American system.

Soon after, in 1984, he was told to deliver frozen blood samples of his patients to Berlin, to the newly founded AIDS Center, to be tested for the "AIDS virus." Before he let his blood out, he checked what's the evidence for the accuracy and reliability of the HIV antibody test, and he realized that this test is not able to detect the virus. It is not able to say yes or no, you are or are not infected. It is only able to say that you have a higher or lower amount of antibodies. That's how the HIV antibody test was and is designed.

Zenger's: It's my understanding that when you have an antibody test that is actually useful, like the antibody test for syphilis, you get a high or a low antibody reaction, and it's a certain multiple of how many times you dilute the original sample and still have the reaction. Therefore you know not only that the infection is present, but also how well the immune system is responding to it.

Dr. Lanka: I'm absolutely sure that no antibody test in medicine has any absolute meaning. Especially in HIV antibody testing, it is clear that the antibodies that are detected in the test are present in everybody. Some people have them in higher concentrations, and some in lower concentrations, but only when you reach a very high level of antibodies -- much higher than in any other antibody testing -- are you considered to be "positive." This is a contradiction in terms because in other antibody tests, the lower your level of antibodies, the higher your risk for a symptomatic infection. But with HIV they say you are "positive" only when you have reached a very high level of antibodies. Below this level, you are said to be negative.

Zenger's: So this is what Dr. Roberto Giraldo was talking about when he spoke to H.E.A.L. in San Diego. He said that when they do the HIV antibody test they dilute the sample to 1/400 of its original strength, and if they didn't do that all the samples would test positive.

Dr. Lanka: That's it. How ridiculous. Dr. Kremer knew this already by 1984. He was very worried about the fate of his patients, because in 1984 the politicians asked him to put these already stigmatized "HIV-positive" patients into quarantine, which means to separate them from the other ones. He said no, because there's no infectious entity out there. He knew everybody who went through chronic active hepatitis or had the hepatitis B vaccine would test "HIV-positive." So he knew that there is no infection in his hospital.

He informed the mass media, who went to his hospital to inform themselves, in great detail. He told them all the evidence. And the very same journalists, in talk shows, in Der Spiegel [one of Germany's largest and most popular magazines] for example, published just the contrary. So he knew that it was intentional from the very beginning. They played war. They all wanted to have a blood and sex plague, contrary to the evidence which he presented to them. So he knew that AIDS was built up on misconceptions. He was dealing at the top political level. They told him, off the record, that they knew, they didn't care, it was about how to deal with the drug problem and with the homosexuals.

They even tried to kill him, and this didn't succeed. He had a good intuition and got out of his car before the tire blew out. Then he learned from a minister who had a deep respect for him, because of his work with prisoners and drug abusers, that the German government was carrying out a secret psychological investigation, trying to prove that he was mentally ill and being kept in his job only because they considered him in danger of committing suicide. So when he learned this, he left his very highly-ranked position because he was not able to be silent on this. That would not fit his ethics.

I also met Professor Alfred Hässig of Switzerland. He founded Swiss blood-donation system and was one of the first to take out products from the blood in order to make plasma to treat chronic disease. By becoming a colleague and a very close friend of his by now, I learned a great deal about the whole blood-producing industry and the criminal energy behind it. In March of 1996 in Berne [capital of Switzerland], Hässig, Kremer and I met for the first time.

It became clear, also, what's happening in the field of hepatitis. They are not dealing with a virus. Of course, there's a possibility to enrich certain kinds of proteins in blood products, which then cause severe autoimmune reactions, but only in very stressed-out people, never in non-stressed people. When they learned to take out these proteins from the blood products, or dilute them, there are not hepatic problems anymore. I learned this through him.

Zenger's: Are you saying that all forms of hepatitis are non- infectious, or just some of them?

Dr. Lanka: No, there's no such thing as infectious hepatitis.

Zenger's: So there are no hepatitis viruses, either.

Dr. Lanka: Yes. Hässig was always fighting to make sure that blood products were produced only on the basis of a small pool of donors who were young and healthy. The industry started to produce blood products on the basis of commercial blood donations, using a huge amount of blood samples, pooling them all together in a large pool, because then it was much cheaper to get out all the various kinds of products.

Zenger's: In this country, it gets even worse because blood donations are one of the principal ways homeless people have of staying alive. As a result, we're taking a lot of our blood supply from people in society who have the least healthy lifestyles.

Dr. Lanka: I know all the details. This what I'm going to tell you. Professor Hässig once met the person responsible for the industry to produce industrial blood products, and once, when this person was drunk while visiting the Fiji Islands after a conference in Australia, this person told Professor Hässig that soon they are going to smash the state-owned blood producing units, based on voluntary blood donations, because they're much cheaper producing their blood products because they go into the Third World countries, and they are already there in all the prisons of the dictators in South America and elsewhere.

When Hässig heard about this, he rang some of his friends -- and, of course, Hässig was the leading person in the blood business -- and at this time there were some non-corrupted people in the WHO (World Health Organization). So, in an emergency meeting, on short notice so the industry had not time to corrupt the members who decided on these issues, they decided that the position of the WHO would be that it isn't allowed to produce plasma in the Third World, because they would bleed them out.

Now they are bleeding out the poorest of the poor, and they are going to Mexico, near where we are sitting right now. In order to help the commercial blood products industry, the FDA [U.S. Food and Drug Administration] has approved that a single person may give up to 50 units of plasma a year. That means he may drop in two times a week to give blood and liver plasma. And an elephant wouldn't possibly survive that, right? So that's the background, and what they did when all that was in place was they changed the way they were treating hemophiliacs. It started in California.

Up to the year 1969 it was forbidden to give the clotting factors to hemophiliacs unless they had internal bleeding. If they would give them prophylactically, antibodies would be produced because these blood products are highly contaminated. In 1969 the industry started to convince some medical doctors -- and the first one was a woman doctor in California -- to treat hemophiliac patients prophylactically with those clotting factors, and this is how the industry made a lot of money. And, of course, the bodies of these hemophiliacs made a lot of antibodies against those products, which had been foreseen. They've had to use higher doses of clotting factors ever since, in order to compete with those antibodies, so that those clotting factors actually work. They gradually have to increase the amount they are injecting.

This has been the biggest business in the blood industry ever since. Nobody's speaking about this, but that's why almost all hemophiliacs have come down with hepatitis. If you inject such a high amount of foreign proteins, and all the contaminants, then of course the liver, as the central metabolic organ, is stressed out, resulting in hepatic inflammations. A lot of hemophiliacs died from hepatitis, and it was blames on nonexistent viruses.

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